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But whether or not it makes it to the front page is up to the users, no? People submit their own content all the time, I see no harm in it, as long as the content is of good quality and contributes something to the conversation. This image? Not so much.
No, anybody with a Twitter account can vote up and disappear. These posts have been voted up by outsiders who have no stake in the community.
Do you have any proof to support this claim?
Well, if you get 11 votes in a few hours and then not a single one on the homepage after 2 days... but I'm not an official person here so I can't see who votes. I see who comments though, only 0 karma strangers saying "voted".
I will say that the algo is getting more advanced and we are starting to look at weighting votes from specific users different than highly engaged user. For example someone who just comes and votes for one article won't have as much weight as someone who is here often and votes/submits content that goes hot.
I "flag" obvious self-promotion all the time and would encourage anyone else who's concerned to do so. I think the system works much better when folks don't promote their own work. It also shows off the real authority/usability of your content better if you don't have to submit it yourself. :)
I have no problem with the occasional self submitted post as long as there some common sense, heck, even Danny Sullivan self promotes his won post here. When someone submits 15 of his own posts in a row and pushes them via outsiders each time it's a problem especially if this person never submits anything else. Two of the flagged posts in this image stem from such people.
I don't get it...
I'm with john...
The Adam Justice one is particularly bad. He's never submitted ANYTHING that isn't from his own site. And he's never made a single comment.
And this guy's almost as bad: http://inbound.org/member/tacticalsales/articles/
At least he has no voting ring.
John, have you checked out the actual posts I flagged above in the image and the the users who submitted them? I really like to know people so I notice blatant self promotion.
I can say I have submitted my own stuff before. I read an interview with Rand and he said he didn't mind as long as it was something like the 1/20 rule and of course good stuff. I think the team here does a great job moderating. The only thing I see is ever since mozcon, Inbound is getting more popular, which I'm sure is making there jobs harder. As the community grows it might be helpful to clarify the guidelines a little more.
Like I said above, submitting ONLY your posts and getting them voted up artificially again and again is the problem. When Danny Sullivan or Jason Acidre self submit from time to time it's not an issue because they have done a whole lot for the community.
I think the guidelines are clear enough, but people interpret them differently. You're right, this becomes more of an issue as it becomes more popular. I think I know which article/interview you're referring to, and from it, I remember a 1/100 rule.
Self-promotion isn't terrible - in moderation. In Rand's own words: "If you’re submitting 1/100 things you produce, that’s fine. If it’s closer to 1/10, that’s probably crossing a line. We don’t currently ban/remove for self-promotion or self-submissions, but we will ban accounts that consistently submit low-quality stuff (from anywhere)." Source: http://seono.co.uk/2012/06/25/interview-rand-fishkin-inbound-org/ Like Ian says, people like AJ take the mick, though. I'm sure Rand wouldn't mind more often than 1/100 IF the user a) also submits a lot of other people's stuff and b) contributes with comments, too. :-)
...Just to clarify, I mean AJ as in Adam Justice, not AJ Kohn! :-)
The bigger problem I'm starting to notice is authority bias. I'm sorry, but not EVERY post from Rand is 'solemnly' good. That's one con of the point system. It's easy to hit the submit button when a post is from an authority site or figure. I'm guilty of this myself. I have to remind myself, it's not about the points, it's the karma itself that comes from sharing the 'best' of inbound marketing. Hopefully, others can too.
+1
Not every post by Rand gets popular but I've noticed the problem too, I'd call that brand bias.
2/6 isn't too bad. :-P
One thing that people don't seem to be using is the flagging system. In looking at the data, only a small percentage of non-admin users are flagging content that we have removed. If you don't feel that the content belongs there or isn't the best, flag it please. When a specific ratio is hit, it's removed for an admin to review. We also have been working on improving the algo to look for people manipulating the voting system to prevent some of the problem. As always we are always working to improve the algo and make sure that the best content gets showcased on the homepage. Please continue to let us know how we can make things better.
Casey, How an evergreen section that contains undisputed 'best of the best' learning material IE., Moz beginner's guide, Oli Gardner's online marketing infographic on moz, etc. The hot & incoming seem to be best for daily users of Inbound and inter-advanced online marketers. For these groups, it's in their nature to keep up with all the latest trends, news, tactics, etc. They're also familiar with many of the members here. But Inbound's missing out on showcasing the basic, fundamental, evergreen content that's helpful for marketers of all levels.
Good idea, most visited posts would be also great.
I can't upvote this one enough. Awesome idea that would be super valuable to new people coming in.
I'll see what I can do. Would you look at the number of upvotes or actual clicks that went out to the page?
Good question. You can start with upvotes or clicks but the next step (just as crucial) is, how do we seed out useless pieces like the iAcquire one that's still getting clicks/upvotes? I'm guessing the only way would be manually.
Yeah, I stopped submitting my own content when I read that comment from Rand a month or so ago. I would imagine that a lot of people who do submit their own stuff are unaware that it is not what is expected.
I didn't realize. Thanks for the heads-up, I'll make sure to only submit other people's excellent content :)
Who cares? So long as the content is good, there should be no concern over whether the user submitting the content is the creator of it as well. There's nothing inherently wrong with submitting your own content to any aggregator, just don't submit shitty content.
I think where you have a problem is when people believe their shitty content is good content. There's the saying: "you're your own worst critic," but the other side of it is when people think their content is awesome when it isn't. So I think that if someone else shares it, it's more of an indicator that it must actually be good, rather than the submitter/creator just thinking themselves that it's good, when it might not be.
totally this place just looks like reposts of seomoz and their lovers. if not from community then stuff gets devoted or just deleted if gets too high place. https://twitter.com/igl00FTW/status/230340206295924737 ie i said that here
I'd like to see the algo take into account more of what happens after it's submitted. Upvotes are easy to game and it clearly happens, but comments (relevant to the subject matter) are the true metric of the "shareability" of the content. For what is the point of sharing anything if it's not worthy of fostering discussion. Sincerely, A. Lurker
To share my experience: I've written a guide to online marketing for startups, placed it here and asked 2-3 friends to upvote, it ended on page one (HOT) and I've got 16-17 upvotes and some 80+ tweets. And I don't consider myself a "brand". This is a great site, but if the community will curate it enough it will become even better. In the end, I don't want to end up on homepage reading just SEOMoz, SEOBook and SEL. My 5 cents.